Tiago Rodrigues: “To write a fascist speech I spent hours studying how they lie and manipulate. And hours of showering to free myself”

How many times did what you thought was impossible to happen in the political scene and in Portuguese society finally become possible? How many times has the world seemed impossible to bear, due to wars, hunger, crisis, extremism, polarization, hopelessness and violence, renewed threats to democracy and freedom?

And how many times has a piece of news, an event – a certain candidacy or electoral result – seemed to come out of a play or a film?

The director, playwright and current artistic director of the Avignon Festival in France, Tiago Rodrigues, has long chosen theater to reflect on life, society, the world and the best and worst of humanity.

His shows are always an event. Among dozens of them, it is worth highlighting “Sopro”, from 2019, which paid homage to Cristina Vidal, the last female star of the Teatro Nacional D Maria II, who for more than 25 years was the invisible breath of so many actresses and actors.

But there is another play written and directed by you, which is certainly part of one of the most important, necessary and disruptive shows in contemporary Portuguese theater.

Its title is “Catarina and the Beauty of Killing Fascists”, which provoked controversy even before it premiered, just because of its name, and which since 2020 has sold out venues, received awards, and given rise to a rich and intense debate about what is important to do to defend democracy. And about the new ultra radical right-wing threats now that the 50th anniversary of April 25th is being celebrated.

Tiago Rodrigues’ text has since given rise to a book that has just been released, by Tinta da China, and which appears to be an oracle of the disastrous times we are living in and what could yet happen to freedom in Portugal.

The play focuses on a family whose tradition is to kill fascists, a ritual that the youngest of them all, Catarina, refuses to carry out.

The show raises questions such as: “Is there a place for violence in the fight for a better world? Can we violate the rules of democracy to better defend it?” The play ends with a long and manipulative speech by a member of an ultra-populist right-wing party, then in power, which in 2020 had only one deputy, but managed to reach 117, achieving an absolute majority.

And almost always, every night, people left the room, others shouted furiously at the stage, others squirmed in their seats, or got up because it was unbearable to bear what they were hearing. A social experience in theater without memory in our country. Life, theater, life. Theater taking the pulse of the moment we live in and serving as a mirror and lens to question the public, who felt forced to join the game.

Tiago reveals in this podcast the process of creating this piece, the discussions and doubts, and the surprising situations that occurred throughout the show’s career.

A huge shock caused by Tiago Rodrigues reminding us that theater, and art in general, can also serve this purpose. It should also work for this. To reflect on the state of things. In this conversation, Tiago Rodrigues opens the curtain and reveals the behind-the-scenes and the doubts that plagued the team until its debut.

This conversation with Tiago Rodrigues, current director of the Avignon festival, in France, who was previously director of the Teatro Nacional D. Maria II, takes place in the aftermath of his latest show “Na Measure do Impossível”, which was on stage until a few days ago by Culturgest, drawn from interviews with people who work at the International Committee of the Red Cross and Doctors Without Borders.

A piece that rescues the experience of humanitarian professionals to talk about their experiences in the extreme conditions in which they work daily.

How to manage a refugee camp? How to deal with life or death choices? How can you continue when you know you won’t change the world? What moves them? Is there hope in those who work in scenarios of violence and hopelessness? Tiago responds to all of this.

And more. He explains what the experience of being an emigrant in France, and director of the largest Theater Festival in the world, is like, and states that he does theater to combat loneliness, to meet others, and that he always has one foot in the spring.

As you know, the generic is signed by Marcia and has the collaboration of He had taken. The portraits are by Matilde Fieschi. And the sound design of this podcast is João Ribeiro.

See you next week and happy listening!